~Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body
~Subject: Re: Attempts at going OOB
~Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1993 06:27:25 GMT

Gary Kaminski (garyk@garyk.mentorg.com) wrote:
: In article <1ogqnnINNss9@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, rbalkenh@sookit.jpl.nasa.gov
: (robert balkenhol) writes:
: |>  ---STUFF DELETED-----
: |>
: |> 2: Be prepared for mind-boggling fear to occur at any moment once the
: |>    process occurs. (even if you think you've made yourself believe it
: |>    won't happen, it can surface).
:
: I am interested in striking up a conversation regarding your point #2.
:
: The fear I am talking about is not like any conscious fear we normally
: think about. I have no conscious fear of dying as most might think when
: we talk about leaving the body. The fear I've encountered is like an
: instinct, rather than a thought or emotion. I suspect it may be a by
: product of the ego - the soul's delusive state of being identified with
: the physical body (Yogananda).

I've had three experiences that I would claim are out of body. The first
two were completely terrifying. I was in a state of utter horror as I
tried to get back into my body or motivate my body to make a sound to wake
someone so they would wake me. The third time was a little different: When
the fear started up, some 'conscious' part of me said "wait a minute.
While I'm out here perhaps I can see what is going on". At that point,
while the experience changed dramatically, the physical feeling of fear
was still there - as a matter of fact I was able to experience the fear
more ... leisurely isn't quite the word but it will do.

My heart felt as if it was beating around 200 beats a minute. There was an
electrical feeling coursing through my body, especially in my chest. These
feelings were very intense and very uncomfortable (I kept wondering if my
heart was going to pop) but, while they were SIMILAR to the feeling of
fear, that was NOT the feeling. I suspect the fear is like a histamine
reactive to allergins - the uncomfortable part isn't the allergin but
instead our body's over-reaction.

This feeling is LIKE fear, and my first reactions were to feel it AS fear,
which caused some kind of feed-back - the more intense my fear the
stronger the energy and the more I feared it.

Once I was able to ... manage the experience ('control' is not appropriate
since the feeling - at least for me, now - was not controllable), I was
able to engage in other experiences. In my third episode, I started moving
though walls and through the ground at incredible speeds. I felt like the
Crash Test Dummy of the Astral Plane.

I have some ideas (for next time) on how to slow things down. I suspect
that the sense of speed wasn't because "things were happening quickly"
but, instead, that my mind was going too fast. Like the fear, I was
generating my own reactions.

The statement "the soul's delusive state identified with the physical
body" might have some truth to it. In a sense I have to UNlearn my body's
reality. Things just don't work like they do in the 'real' world, and any
energy towards applying the physical body's knowledge to an OOBE will
backfire.

Sorry for rambling on so much ...

Stefan


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

~From: rbalkenh@sookit.jpl.nasa.gov (robert balkenhol)
~Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body
~Subject: Re: Attempts at going OOB
~Date: 24 Mar 1993 14:51:33 GMT

Gary Kaminski (garyk@garyk.mentorg.com) wrote:
: In article <1ogqnnINNss9@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, rbalkenh@sookit.jpl.nasa.gov
: (robert balkenhol) writes:
: |>  ---STUFF DELETED-----
: |> My advice is:
: |>
: |> 1: LET (as opposed to force) it happen. I, for one, can't relax enough
: |>    to start the process if I'm trying to MAKE something happen.
: |> 2: Be prepared for mind-boggling fear to occur at any moment once the
: |>    process occurs. (even if you think you've made yourself believe it
: |>    won't happen, it can surface).
: |> 3: Learn to remember (or write down) the experience, or it will slip
: |>    away.
:
: I am interested in striking up a conversation regarding your point #2.
: On my first OOBE I encountered an unrational, intense fear that
: propelled me back to my body with a jolt. Since then I have had one
: peaceful and conscious OOBE. I have had a few dreams with an OOBE theme,
: but I was not fully aware in those. One of these dreams made me realize
: through symbology that I must overcome, or work through, this intense
: fear before I will truly be free.
:
:----Stuff Deleted----
: The fear I am talking about is not like any conscious fear we normally
: think about. I have no conscious fear of dying as most might think when
: we talk about leaving the body. The fear I've encountered is like an
: instinct, rather than a thought or emotion. I suspect it may be a by
: product of the ego - the soul's delusive state of being identified with
: the physical body (Yogananda).
:
: I am not sure how to work through this fear, except to face it again and
: again until I can consciously work through it. I am not sure how to
: bring myself to the edge again. It seems like there is an unconscious
: switch that is turned on to protect me from getting too close to the
: fear threshold. I would think that a hypnotist who is sensitive to this
: area could help, but I wouldn't know where to find one, nor could I
: spend lots of $$ to get through this. Anyone else out there have any
: ideas on this?

I agree that we are not talking your normal run-of-mill fear here. In my
case, it was absolutely consuming. During the period of my first
experiences, I occasionally overcame the fear-thing with curiosity. There
were times when the terror was not quite as intense, and if I was curious
enough, I was able to proceed (although very cautiously).

The real turning point happened when I discovered that I really did have a
fear of death. I had not previously been aware of the fear of death in
myself. In fact I had considered it and dismissed it several times. Then
one night, I awoke in the wee hours absolutely stricken with pain in my
chest. I could not breathe. My heart was beating wildly. My thoughts were
that it couldn't be a heart attack because: 1. I was only in my mid
twenties. 2. My heart WAS beating, even if not normally. I began to fear
for the future of my young family if I *died*. THEN, I began to fear for
**MY** future if I died. The more I worried, the worse the pain. As my
wife was rushing me to the hospital, I reached the point of letting go,
and mentally saying words to the effect that if I had to go, then I had to
go. I began to feel less stressed and a little less discomfort.

The doctors diagnosed my problem as an esophagean spasm -- something I ate
had burned a hole in the lining of my esophagus (sp?) and as a result, it
had clenched. OUCH! They gave me something for it and we went home. So
much for spicy food at bedtime.

Anyway, the next time the vibrations came, it was as if they were my
friends now. Sometimes still though, when I'm oob, I become uncomfortable,
or scared, and dart back to the physical. But it's not the same kind of
fear.

**************************************
Robert Balkenhol
Jet Propulsion Laboratory
internet: rbalkenh@sookit.jpl.nasa.gov
Compu$erve:76114,611
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